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10/18/03 -- Jeb's Emails to FR poster, summer, today, re: Terri. (And, a Message to Michael Shiavo)
10/18/03 | summer's emails with Gov Bush

Posted on 10/18/2003 5:15:50 PM PDT by summer

Note to FR: I am posting here an email conversation I had today with Gov Bush about Terri, and yes, he knows I am posting it here on FR.

In my reply #1, located below this post of Gov Bush’s email, I have posted a message from me to Terri’s husband. And, no, I did not discuss with anyone my idea here to write to Terri’s husband. No one suggested it to me. Nor did I discuss it with anyone at all.

In my next reply, reply #2 below, I hope to post a message to my friends here on FR. And, while I would like to respond to each reply that may be posted on this thread, I can not. Due to a pressing personal matter, I will not be able to respond tonight.

However, my thoughts and prayers and hopes remain with each person involved in this matter.

God bless.

summer


-------------------------------------------------------

----- Original Message -----
From: [summer]
To: Jeb Bush
Sent: Saturday, October 18, 2003 4:46 PM
Subject: Re: …question for you…

Gov Bush,

Thank you, and I have no doubt you would move Heaven and Earth for her if you could.

Sincerely, [summer]

----- Original Message -----
From: Jeb Bush
To: [summer]
Sent: Saturday, October 18, 2003 4:42 PM
Subject: …question for you…

I cannot offer much hope. I am sickened by this situtation and pray for her family. We have looked at every angle, every legal possibility and will continue to do so. It is clear that we need to make living wills the norm for families in our state. Too few people use them.

Jeb


-----Original Message-----
From: [summer]
Sent: Saturday, October 18, 2003 4:38 PM
To: Jeb Bush
Subject: Re: …question for you…

Thank you for your response, Gov Bush. Before I post this, can you provide any measure of hope for a legal way to preserve this woman's life? To think that all her parents want to do is care for her and not see her starve to death, is, I think, not asking for a lot in this world. My own parents would feel the same way about me, I am sure[…]

[summer]

----- Original Message -----
From: Jeb Bush
To: [summer]
Sent: Saturday, October 18, 2003 4:07 PM
Subject: …question for you…

this was tried in the courts I believe and was rejected.

jeb

-----Original Message-----


From: [summer]
Sent: Saturday, October 18, 2003 4:03 PM
To: Jeb Bush
Subject: …question for you…

Is there a way you can utilize Family Law as it pertains to abandonment of a spouse -- on the grounds of lack of sexual contact -- so that the path can be cleared for him to be legally removed by the state or her family as a husband?

-----Original Message-----

From: Jeb Bush
Sent: Oct 18, 2003 1:47 PM
To: [summer]
Subject: …question for you…

Unfortunately, I cannot issue an executive order when there is a court order upheld at every level in the judiciary. Mr. Shiavo is the legal guardian and I can't override that fact. I wish I could but I have no legal authority to do so.

Jeb

-----Original Message-----

From: [summer]
Sent: Saturday, October 18, 2003 11:02 AM
To: Jeb Bush
Subject: …question for you…

Can you use your authority to issue an Executive Order, to place her in a different hospice that has no connection to her husband, as a temporary stop measure to [get] this woman back on feeding -- so that you have the time necessary to review whatever other options may exist for you? This current situation with her removed from the tubes will result in an irrevocable situation.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Extended News; Government; News/Current Events; US: Florida
KEYWORDS: blahblahblah; bushnoballs; caring; catholiclist; communication; deathcultivation; education; explanation; facts; fl; guardians; infomration; information; jebbush; leadership; learn; life; listen; livingwills; masked; memyselfandi; pretend; selfserving; supporters; terri; understanding
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Message to Michael Shiavo, from summer –

Dear Michael,
Believe it or not, when I was in college, I had a boyfriend named “Michael.” And, I was quite sure we would marry and live happily ever after. Quite sure. Certainly that was my wish at the time. But, a situation we unexpectedly faced divided us, and brought us to an impasse. Eventually, things changed between us.

So, I have learned this much in life: over time, people’s views really can change.

Michael, I don’t know all the details in this case. I have not had a chance to read as much about it as I would have liked. I have not called you names nor attended any vigils, but I do not begrudge those who did. I know the people on this forum are sometimes called by others: “right wing nut case wackos.”

But, I will tell you something, Michael. If I was a woman or a child living in Afghanistan, or Iraq, or any number of places around this world; or, I was an American fighter pilot missing for years in the middle east, or any other number of people -- guess who I would want as my friends? Yes. I would want all the “right wing nut case wackos” on my side. Believe me, I would. Other real friends are welcome too. But the “right wing wacko nut cases” are not quite the “wacko nut cases” that others make them out to be. At least not in my book. By the way, I write my own books.

I read somewhere that you are now a new parent. Or you will soon be a new parent again. Congrats to you! And, I am a teacher -- in a public school. A terrific public school, in fact. Maybe someday I will teach one of your children there. Who knows. That would be fine with me, as I work with all kinds of students and parents.

All I want to say to you Michael is this: You are a parent.
And, so, to me, you are clearly on the side of parents. Because you are one yourself.

There are some parents in this legal matter you are involved in who want to care for a child they had many years ago. As a parent yourself, surely you can sympathize with those parents, whoever they may be. As a parent yourself, maybe you could help them. Maybe you could now step aside – and let those parents care for their child. After all, you are a parent too. In short, Michael, you can be on the side of parents – as I see it, that would be your side, Michael. And, I am on that side as well.

What obstacles stop us from joining the side of parents? What your wife of years ago said? What if she said something years ago -- and yet, would say something different today? Things change. I know that myself.

Can you or I or anyone know for certain what such a person as Terri would say today? Or is that something neither you nor I can really know, Michael. As a teacher I ask you this. Speaking philosophically. Can you really know? I mean -- Are you God?

Sometimes people hope and pray for a miracle. In this case, Michael, you can be The Miracle.

Here is a position you can take: You can admit you are not God. And you can not know today what a person in Terri’s position would say today if she could. You may know what she once said. But where did she write it?

In my opinion, it would take quite a man to admit he is not God. Maybe you are such a man. Maybe you are the kind of parent your children will look up because you were suddenly filled with a grace some say is from God, and you decided to walk away - to let another parent love their child.

Parent to parent. Child to child. That is the side this teacher is on. That can be your side, too, Michael. In fact, that IS your side.

So – walk away and lead, as a parent. Lead by example. Be the miracle. For all the parents and children in this world. Like I do each day when I go to work. Work with me.

Finally, below is a song I would like to share with you, Michael. It brings back many memories, including fond memories of a Michael I knew long ago. But it also makes me think of today – and of your children, you, Terri’s parents, Terri’s supporters, and others -- including the young students I teach.

Sincerely,
summer

--------------------------------------------------------

"Beautiful Day"
by U2


The heart is a bloom,
shoots up through the stony ground

There's no room,
no space to rent in this town

You're out of luck
and the reason that you had to care,
The traffic is stuck
and you're not moving anywhere.

You thought you'd found a friend
to take you out of this place
Someone you could lend
a hand in return for grace…

It's a beautiful day!
The sky falls!
And you feel like:
It's a beautiful day!
Don't let it get away…


You're on the road
But you've got no destination
You're in the mud,
in the maze of her imagination
You love this town
even if that doesn't ring true
You've been all over
and it's been all over you

It's a BEAUTIFUL DAY!
(Don't let it get away)
It's a BEAUTIFUL DAY!
(Don't let it get away …)

Touch me, take me to that other place
Teach me, I know I'm not a hopeless case:

See the world in green and blue
See China right in front of you
See the canyons broken by cloud
See the tuna fleets clearing the sea out
See the Bedouin fires at night
See the oil fields at first light
And see the bird with a leaf in her mouth
After the flood all the colors came out


IT WAS A BEAUTIFUL DAY!
BEAUTIFUL DAY!!!

Don't let it get away!


Touch me, take me to that other place
Reach me, I know I'm not a hopeless case


[Michael,]
What you don't have
You don't need it now,
What you don't know
You can feel it somehow,

What you don't have
You don't need it now,
You don't need it now, you don't need it now


It was a Beautiful Day!!!!!!!!!!!!


1 posted on 10/18/2003 5:15:50 PM PDT by summer
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To: All
To my friends on FR, here is my favorite Psalm. I am linking it here for Terri, and for you, and for others who may read this:



The 23rd Psalm

…Surely goodness and mercy shall follow me all the days of my life,

and I will dwell in the House of the Lord forever.
2 posted on 10/18/2003 5:16:41 PM PDT by summer
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To: summer
Is she brain dead Summer?
3 posted on 10/18/2003 5:18:26 PM PDT by A CA Guy (God Bless America, God bless and keep safe our fighting men and women.)
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To: summer
Timely repost of yesterday's comment from Freeper 'Qwinn':

===============================

To: All

Look at yourselves.

You are spending the greatest amount of your time and energy attacking each other, each other's faiths, the Pope, Jeb Bush, Fr. Jorge, Rome, Florida Bishops...

There are two primary enemies in this fight. That is Michael Schiavo and Judge Greer. Save your venom and cries of outrage for them, instead of those who devote their lives to Christian causes and -don't- try to get people killed.

I'm willing to bet that most of these bishops have sent private letters to the people involved (which does NOT include the bishops, Gov. Bush, etc.) Schiavo and Greer are the ones who are properly responsible and who apparently hold all the legal cards in this fight.

Why do they hold the cards? Because of laws that have been established by prior administrations because people voted for the death-culture Democrats.

So how do a great number of you react? "I'll never vote for Jeb Bush again - EVER!" Oh, that's brilliant. He's pro-life, he has sent letters to Greer and Schiavo and everyone else involved, spoken with the family at length, tried two interventions within his power, spoken publicly that what is happening here is wrong and given the Governorship's approval to the fight for Terri... but you'll never vote for him again.

And therefore, the death-culture Dems get into power again and next time, they vote to re-legalize partial birth abortion or some other atrocity.

Stop fighting amongst yourselves. In your rage that no one can stop those two monsters, you instead turn your daggers on each other so you can have the satisfaction of taking your revenge on -someone-, anyone, for this injustice. That doesn't sound like what I've always respected about Christianity to me.

Qwinn

47 posted on 10/17/2003 10:32 PM PDT by Qwinn

4 posted on 10/18/2003 5:20:55 PM PDT by Byron_the_Aussie
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To: Byron_the_Aussie
I agree 100%. Dumping on Jeb Bush distracts attention from the true villains in this case: Schiavo and Greer. Let's put out energy towards prayer and action. Protesting Jeb Bush to call attention to this case is one thing, but ranting against Jeb Bush is pointless, as the real bad guys are Schiavo and Greer.

Please, pray for Terri. Call Jeb Bush, email him, even picket him; but post and pray about Terri.
5 posted on 10/18/2003 5:24:43 PM PDT by utahagen
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To: Byron_the_Aussie; Qwinn
Thanks, Byron, and Qwinn for the original message.

Turning the guns on those on our side is misplaced.

6 posted on 10/18/2003 5:27:20 PM PDT by sinkspur (Adopt a dog or a cat from a shelter! Save a life, and maybe you'll save your own, too!)
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To: Byron_the_Aussie
Ya gotta love the single issue voters who say "I won't vote for Jeb ever again" when they don't know what Jeb has done, and know the legal ins and outs of it all. Amazing.
7 posted on 10/18/2003 5:27:29 PM PDT by RedBloodedAmerican
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To: summer
My husband posited his theory: That Michael wants her dead because he's already contracted to sell her organs.

Wouldn't surprise me in the least.

8 posted on 10/18/2003 5:30:00 PM PDT by Humidston (Do not remove this tag under penalty of law)
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To: sinkspur
Turning the guns on those on our side is misplaced.

Yup, it's the circular firing squad technique. Florida has a Republican gov and state legislature & people are threatening to get rid of them--and replace them with what? Dems?

9 posted on 10/18/2003 5:34:19 PM PDT by Catspaw
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To: RedBloodedAmerican
"Ya gotta love the single issue voters who say 'I won't vote for Jeb ever again' when they don't know what Jeb has done..."

I think the folks who express this are not bad people....they are concerned and worried that Terri could actually die for no good reason. It's frustration on their part and I have to take a step back and let these folks vent. :-}
10 posted on 10/18/2003 5:41:00 PM PDT by Arpege92
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To: Arpege92
I'm not saying they're "bad people", either. I think the knee jerk reaction or whatever it might be called is too abrupt. Consider Jeb (not necessarily you, but whoever would cast him aside) before you go faulting him. Look at what he has done for Florida for the better, consider his character. For him to not do anything on Terri would seem out of character, unless there was a good reason, which from Summers emails, there seems to be.

What blows me away is the mother and father are refused the right to feed their own daughter. But I guess when you get married, the spouse has legal rights. But sometihng doesn't seem to fit here. There must be some sort of loophole where someone can get to her. I am certain Michael has made a will of his own now that if he dies first, he makes sure she won't be cared for in a way that extends her life.
11 posted on 10/18/2003 5:48:19 PM PDT by RedBloodedAmerican
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To: summer
Thanks for your posts. Hope all is (or will soon be) well with you. Take care.
12 posted on 10/18/2003 5:49:40 PM PDT by manna
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To: summer
http://www.worldrtd.org/SchiavoChronology.html

Above URL is time line

Timeline of the Terri Schiavo Case


Adapted from the Associated Press, Dec 25, 2002

The following is the timeline in the case of Terri Schiavo, who first collapsed and fell into a coma in 1990. The conflict between Terri Schiavo's parents, Bob and Mary Schindler, began in 1993, and continues to this day. The court bhattle began in 1998, when Michael Schiavo petitioned the court to remove Terri Schiavo's feeding tube.



- Feb. 25, 1990: Terri Schiavo collapses in her home. Doctors believe a potassium imbalance caused her heart to stop, temporarily cutting off oxygen to her brain.

- Nov. 1992: Terri's husband, Michael, wins malpractice suit against doctors who he say misdiagnosed his wife; jury awards more than more than $700,000 for her care, Michael receives an additional $300,000.

- Feb. 14, 1993: Terri Schiavo's parents, Bob and Mary Schindler have a falling out with Michael over the malpractice suit money and Terri's care.

- July 29, 1993: Bob and Mary Schindler file petition to have Michael Schiavo removed as Terri's guardian. The case is later dismissed.

- May 1998: Michael Schiavo files petition to remove Terri's feeding tube.

- Jan. 24, 2000: Trial begins over whether to remove feeding tube.

- Feb. 11, 2000: Pinellas-Pasco Circuit Judge George W. Greer rules feeding tube can be removed.

- Jan. 24, 2001: 2nd District Court of Appeal upholds Greer's decision.

- March 29, 2001: Greer rules feeding tube to be removed at 1 p.m. April 20.

- April 18, 2001: Florida Supreme Court refuses to intervene in the case.

- April 20, 2001: U.S. District Judge Richard Lazzara grants the Schindlers a stay until April 23 to exhaust appeals.

- April 23, 2001: U.S. Supreme Court refuses to intervene.

- April 24, 2001: Feeding tube is removed from Terri Schiavo.

- April 26, 2001: Pinellas-Pasco Circuit Judge Frank Quesada orders doctors to reinsert Terri's feeding tube; the Schindlers pursue lawsuit against Michael Schiavo, accusing him of committing perjury by saying his wife did not want to be kept on life support.

- April 30, 2001: Lawyers for Michael Schiavo file emergency motion with an appellate court asking for the court to order removal of Terri's feeding tube.

- June 25, 2001: 2nd District Court of Appeal hears arguments in case.

- July 11, 2001: 2nd DCA sends case back to Greer, ruling that Terri can't be taken off life support until after July 23.

- July 18, 2001: Schindlers ask Greer to let their doctors evaluate Terri before making a final decision on removing the feeding tube.

- Aug. 7, 2001: Attorneys receive Greer's order that the tube be removed Aug. 28.

- Aug. 8, 2001: Schindlers repeat request to Greer to allow their doctors to evaluate Terri.

- Aug. 10, 2001: Greer denies the Schindlers' evaluation request, as well as their request to remove Michael Schiavo as guardian.

- Sept. 26, 2001: Schindlers' attorneys argue before 2nd District Court of Appeal, citing testimony from seven doctors who say Terri can recover with the right treatment.

- Oct. 3, 2001: 2nd DCA delays removal of feeding tube indefinitely.

- Oct. 17, 2001: 2nd DCA rules that five doctors can examine Terri to determine whether she has any hope of recovery. Two doctors are picked by the Schindlers, two are picked by Michael Schiavo and one is picked by the court.

- Feb. 13, 2002: Mediation attempts fail; Michael Schiavo again seeks to be allowed to remove Terri's feeding tube.

- Oct. 12, 2002: Weeklong hearing begins in the case. Three doctors, including the one appointed by the court, testify that Terri is in a persistent, vegetative state with no hope of recovery. The two doctors selected by the Schindlers say she can recover.

- Nov. 12, 2002: The Schindlers' attorney says medical records suggest Terri's condition may have been brought on by physical abuse, and asks for more time to get more evidence.

- Nov. 22, 2002: Greer rules that there is no evidence that Terri has any hope of recovery and orders feeding tube to be removed Jan. 3, 2003.

- Dec. 13, 2002: Circuit Judge George W. Greer stays order to remove feeding tube on Jan. 3 until the 2nd District Court of Appeal in Lakeland reviews the case. A date has not been set for the court to hear the case.

- Dec. 25, 2002 The 2nd District Court of Appeals agrees to consider appeal by Schiavo's parents. Schedules oral arguments for April 4.

13 posted on 10/18/2003 5:57:13 PM PDT by HuntsvilleTxVeteran (CCCP = clinton, chiraq, chretien, and putin = stalin wannabes)
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To: All
"Terri had communion today... Here is the link...check posts 11 and 12

102 posted on 10/18/2003 5:03 PM PDT by shezza
14 posted on 10/18/2003 5:57:59 PM PDT by LADY J
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To: LADY J
The link

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/1003524/posts?page=102

15 posted on 10/18/2003 5:59:18 PM PDT by LADY J
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To: RedBloodedAmerican
The timing of all this is interesting too.
Will the "Jeb didn't do enough" translate into lost votes for W in 2004?
Is this the FSC 'payback' for 2000?
Has "someone" prodded "hubby dearest" to pull her plug now rather than later?
Or, is the time/place/persons involved merely coincidental?
( I know, I know....the tinfoil goes shiny-side out ) :))
16 posted on 10/18/2003 6:00:09 PM PDT by Salamander (Vast Left-Wing Conspiracy Theory Mander)
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To: summer
Thank you for posting your questions and Governor Bush's responses, summer. He is a good man and I'm sure is finding his inability to do something painful.

Thank you, too, for the beautiful personal appeal to Michael Schiavo. If that doesn't turn his heart, I don't know what will. You are a treasure to education in Florida and to those who have gotten to 'know' you at FreeRepublic.
17 posted on 10/18/2003 6:04:19 PM PDT by windchime
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To: RedBloodedAmerican
People aren't finding fault with all of the good things Jeb has done for Florida. Again, it's just the fear they feel for Terri and although it may come across as a little harsh, I still think they are just venting. Just my opinion on the matter....:-}
18 posted on 10/18/2003 6:06:31 PM PDT by Arpege92
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To: All
I think that the next step is to petition to have this made a criminal case based on the STRANGUALTION AND ABUSE related evidence and nurse's affidavits that clearly exist.
This way if Terri is saved the skunk(Micheal) at least pulls some orange suit and cuffs time and if she dies than SO DOES HE by the state mandated lethal injection.
19 posted on 10/18/2003 6:12:45 PM PDT by Coral Snake (Why do we allow a purjuring, software pirate traitor to continue to run our computers?)
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To: sinkspur; summer; cpforlife.org
...turning the guns on those on our side is misplaced...

You misunderstood my intent, amigo.

There's nothing wrong with turning the guns on Jeb Bush. Every so often an issue comes along where a politician who makes much of his faith is called upon to place his duty to it above duty to his office. Reagan's visit to Bitburg being one example. Jeb should go right down to the wire on this one and leave no legal or other stone unturned to ensure Terri is not judicially murdered by Shiavo and Greer. Anything Freeper activists can do to encourage him in that direction is of benefit. My reading of Qwinn's post is that we should 1. keep in mind that the principle villains are the murderous husband and his enabling judge, and 2. not let the Terri case devolve into energy-diverting squabbles between FR's Catholics and Protestants. See the original thread, for context. Regards, By

20 posted on 10/18/2003 6:16:24 PM PDT by Byron_the_Aussie
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